But, he did it with them first

Here’s an issue I see in myself as well as in other betrayed spouses. It is not so much a complaint as just the reality of a feeling.

MindlessCraft has done a lot to “make-up” for shit. He has taken me to expensive hotels and luxurious spas, weekends away, romantic dinner dates (not just eating out together because he has to do something for birthday or anniversary), and given flowers more times than I can count. He has done far more of these things for me than he ever did for any AP. Yet, he did it for them first (during our marriage). And, it is an awful feeling to me. He may now do such things out of love for me, but I cannot help but realize he is only doing it after he did it for someone else first.

I explained it to him like this. This is going to be GRAPHIC, but it is the only way to make the point. I don’t like blow jobs, and though I’ve tried from time-to-time, I’ve never given one to completion and certainly have never swallowed. Now, I tell MC, imagine I cheat on you and then not only give the guy a blow job (without him even asking), but take him all the way and swallow too. All before I ever did it for you, even though we’ve been married for YEARS. You will always know I did it for him first. How would that make you feel?

And, that example really made him “get it.” He understands. But, what can you do about that?  You cannot change the past.

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25 thoughts on “But, he did it with them first

  1. Not quite the same, 😉 but OH did take the OW to places he never thought to take me and that is hurtful because some of them were vegetarian restaurants and cafes, which are unusual in the city where we live.Yet I am a vegetarian. She was not. It makes me very angry when I remember these things. He also took her to places that were already special to me so now they are completely tainted for me. Not sure I will ever forgive that aspect of his betrayal.

    Liked by 4 people

    1. Oh Falling Ash, I think it is a very similar feeling and just one that is so hard to overcome. I’m not sure if I can ever overcome that feeling. And, equally frustrating, I’m not sure there is anything more MC can do to help me overcome that feeling. Though, I don’t know, maybe there is a way. . .Regardless, one of the hardest parts to accept, let alone forgive.

      Liked by 4 people

  2. Oh wow, you have nailed EXACTLY my feelings, too. It is unfathomable the pain I feel when I think of all “the firsts” my husband did with the whores. Tiger Lily, you put in words the excruciating pain I feel when I think of how my husband put them “first” in his mind, behavior and thoughts over me. It is unbearable when I start thinking about it.
    My husband is a sex addict. We have been married 38 years and for 28 years he cheated on me with whores, porn and masturbation. Our D-day was Dec 2014, when I saw emails on his phone to whores.
    I have been reading your blog now for about 6 months, and it is so very insightful, helpful and caring. Tiger Lily, your journey has been truly so helpful to me, as you are able so well to articulate your feelings and they are my feelings, too. The horrific pain and hurt that you write about are my feelings, too And, Mindless Craft, what you have shared has been also very insightful to me to help me better understand my husband’s thinking and behavior. MC, your sharing of what you felt and thought while you were acting out has given me so VERY much insight and understanding of a cheater’s thinking. I realize that obviously you and my husband are different individuals, but so very much of what you shared truly helps me understand the unfaithful’s thinking.
    I want to thank you both so VERY MUCH for your blog. It has helped me tremendously as I navigate the most horrible, excruciating and debilitating journey of my life. Blessings to you both for sharing your journey with everyone – your sharing has truly been a miracle that has helped me so much.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Janice, thank you so much for your kind words and for posting to us. While it is so hard and sad to know that our story is not an uncommon one, it also gives a much needed connection to a community that is all too hidden in the non-internet world. Blessings back to you and your husband as you deal with this shit storm! We deserve to not only be first in their minds now, but to have been first all along. It is like a rabbit trying to lead us to its rabbit hole. ❤ TL

      Liked by 1 person

  3. I recognise this all too well !

    Since D-day and his road to recovery by learning not to lie in any shape of form, my husband has been doing things differently and he is a better husband, father and person. But…it took a crisis and me falling apart to have these changes.
    THAT, I am struggling with.
    With the OW, he did special things and only after he was confronted with his despicable actions (by me), did he want to make things right by doing special things with me and for me.
    We just came back from a trip and although it was good and we got further in re-connecting, these thoughts still bother me. He gets most of it: Finally!

    I did obtain one realisation: I saw that he is as hurt as me about his actions. This was after a rant from me in a very nice hotel as it had triggered me being there.
    His face was full of pain. I do not want to forget this face and I want to use this visual to reduce my ranting when I am in pain, because he is too.

    He did these special things with this OW to impress her. He made sure he looked good to impress her, but he is ashamed by it now and he hates every thought about this episode in his life. He hates how he was when he did these things.

    So, although it cannot be undone and he became a better person AFTER the crisis, I am trying to see this as “collateral beauty”. It stings me badly at times but the knowledge and the conviction (by now) that he despised himself (in hindsight) about who he was when with the OW, helps me to get through this.

    My next step is to shut my mouth more. He does not need to hear the same-old-same-old anymore as he knows.

    It is a rocky road and I do think (like others) that we will never fully recover. My husband has changed and I want to recognise this. That he changed because of a crisis is a shame. I had so wanted him to see things prior to going off the deep end. I did talk, but he was not ready to see where he was heading. I could not have done anything more than I did.

    A crisis was needed to safe him and our marriage. I did not need this crisis, it has done damage to me and my trust in him and respect for him. I still have a long road to go.

    Elisabeth

    Liked by 5 people

    1. It is a horrible feeling that leads to nothing positive (at least none I’ve yet to discover). Mindless often tells me he didn’t do these things for his APs, even if they believed otherwise. He did them to get what he wanted from them, so really it was always done for himself, not them. On some level, I get that, but it doesn’t really help. Perhaps, I need to do something fantasy like just for me, maybe that would help? And, I don’t mean something illicit or adulterous, just something special just for me without MC being part of it, even if it is something he would enjoy. He can stay home with the kids while I do this. Perhaps I can go with my cousin and/or a dear friend from a previous place we lived, kind of a girls’ get-a-way adventure. Perhaps that is seeking justice more than healing though? Or, perhaps it is something other than or in addition to justice? I don’t know. Unfortunately, even if it would help, I could never use limited family time or spend our money on something like that, when we have so many competing goals that take precedence. Perhaps I am angry that he could so easily spend our family time and our money like that (except even worse), and I never could and still can’t get over the guilt enough to do it when it is just for me.

      Liked by 4 people

      1. TL,
        I totally get that.
        I am angry too that my husband so easily could leave his family for work trips, even when he knew that the time he was away would be so hard on me based on the special needs of our son. He just knew I would do my utmost, and he just left.
        I could have forgiving him for that as his work was also helping the family financially, His actions of arranging “fuck trips” have made me question everything.

        I know that I would not have been able to leave him with the kids if it was me who wanted to travel for work. I would have done everything to obtain a job that did not involve travel. I know that he had those options. He did not take them as he wanted to have a more exciting job. He loved international projects. He loved them more than us and he left even when our son was sick. I know I would not have been able to place my own needs above the needs of my kids and husband.

        MC: My husband is trying to make up for it, but it is hard as I would have accepted his “need” for international experience if he had not done the other things. Now, I see all of it as selfish.

        Travel together is difficult at first because it was travel that took him away and it was travel and hotels that gave him easy access to the OW and porn. I hope this mixed feeling will one time disappear. But for now, the first night in an hotel is hard on me. Going out for a fancy dinner is hard too as I know he did that with the OW. Always a taxi…that lazy person, while I always walk.
        One very bad thing is that he took that person to a type of restaurant that is rare to find and not present where we live. The type of food has a special meaning to us as a couple and to our families. That OW would not even know how to appreciate it! But, he took that person there three times and it ruined it for me forever. I just cannot understand why he had to do that. I will not eat that food ever again. He made it dirty.
        Entering a fancy restaurant, I always look around and my thoughts are “who else is here fucking someone else than their partner”? This is not a good start of an evening. What my husband can do is being gentle and understanding and doing his best to make the evening “us” !

        Liked by 2 people

    2. No, Elizabeth, I do think you and TL will never fully recover, and that our marriages will never fully recover. Paradoxically, at the same time, our marriages are better than they ever were; now more genuine and caring.

      I’m glad your husband was able to give you that look of understanding for a moment. Don’t be too easy on him. He, like me, can never take away the pain we’ve caused.

      Elizabeth, is there anything your husband (and similarly me with TL) could do to help you with all those stolen “firsts?”

      Liked by 2 people

      1. Please don’t take my comment above to be discouraging. I’m not saying things are hopeless or too difficult. I’m just saying that I get how hurtful those stolen firsts are.

        On a separate note, we really are making great progress on our marriage.

        Liked by 2 people

      2. 1. My husband can no longer lie and deceive me in any shape or form. When I ask a question I require a straight answer.
        2. He no longer can make decisions that impact me and our family without consulting with me first.
        3. He has to place our family first above work and colleagues.
        4. He needs to ask me what I feel and what I want or need and never assume.
        5. Certain things I can claim back, others I want to avoid as he made it dirty. He needs to accept that.
        6. I like it when he truly listens to me and takes actions based on what I told him. It means that he wanted to hear and that he knows it is important to me.
        7. I want him to be assertive and to stand up for what he used to believe before he let himself become a corrupt rich white bastard. I saved him from himself, and I want him to do the work from now onward. No more over-the-top- ridiculous resort experiences with the company owner and his side-kicks (all without spouses).
        8. We can not turn back time, but make the most of it now. Things that were important to me are no longer that crucial, but some are. I want him to listen to me and pick up on these things and do them for me without me having to ask for it. This means that I feel loved and valued.
        9. It means changing habits, but I want him to use “us” instead of “me”. His solo life is over, he made a mess and he hurt our kids and me and himself.
        10. The no-lying rule is most important. It is harder for him than he thought it was. He even lies when he does not have to. When I caught him (the fight in the hotel room) something broke in me. I thought that all was broken already and I was on the mend, but, he managed to break something again by lying, by answering a colleague during our holiday in the late evening after a nice supper. Not only did he lie, he also blamed me for it at first. This most be over! He needs to take full responsibility over all of these actions.

        Liked by 3 people

        1. E, This is spot on. We must have a foundation of complete honesty on which to build, otherwise we are simply rebuilding on quicksand. And, as strong and capable as we may be, I do not want to ever again walk, run or be thrown into quicksand! And, the other points you listed are all wanted and needed to rebuild. But, true rebuilding doesn’t have a chance without building a strong foundation devoid of any quicksand pits!

          Liked by 3 people

          1. Yes, so true. I noticed how fragile I felt after I caught him in a lie (again). I immediately thought “what else is he not telling” and I felt stupid to be in that position again. Indeed it feels like quicksand. I do not want to be there anymore. I told him how much damage it did and that I cannot keep on “getting over it”. The lying has to stop. The justifications for lying are invalid. His communication has to be better and “prompto” in the sense that when an issue comes up that needs to be discussed, he will no longer leave it too late (until I find out).
            I do the same. When a work proposal comes in whether I need to travel or not, I always discuss it with him. I have always done that.
            At times I feel so stupid that I accepted from him that “his work was sacred” and not my business. Many times in the past I did not even know when and where he needed to go for work. I never asked who was accompanying him. I foolishly trusted him.
            …and maybe…as one other blogger wrote that blindly trusting a partner was what I should not have done.

            Liked by 2 people

  4. Oh the blow job analogy hits home because that was the ow’s signature move. Swallow and all. Due to a trauma, this is not something I’m willing to do. Ever. Especially after the affair. I’m sure if we gad worked with a sex therapist before the a, I maybe could have but I will never address it again. And it pains me so much that he got something he wanted from her. And that I was left behind so he could hook up with a 50 yr old married employee who would blow her boss. It’s not sexy, but it sends me on a bad spiral. I think if the first sexual act they did was with her on her knees, it’s degrading to her and degrading of him. But it was quite a pull. And that will never be me. And it’s another thing that makes me feel less than.

    Liked by 5 people

    1. This analogy hits home with me too. This was also my husband’s OW signature move as well. I think it’s all of the OW’s signature moves. I never really enjoyed giving blow jobs until I found out this was what she enjoyed. Weirdly enough once I found out about the affair I wanted to do this. Maybe subconsciously I needed to show him I was better at it then her. I think I felt I needed to take my power back.

      Liked by 4 people

      1. Lemondrop and Forverchanged, I understand.

        Before d-day, I felt emotionally unsafe in our sex life. If he liked something I did, I got 20 questions (x10) about how I knew how to do it, with whom I had ever done it, etc.? I did sometimes fantasize about just such an experience. But, making that fantasy a reality, experimenting with something I felt uncomfortable with when trying to put fantasy into reality, was emotionally unsafe, and so not something I wanted to pursue given such a hostile environment. After d-day, I am physically fearful as I don’t want HSV2 on my mouth. He had assured me that he had his HSV2 under control, knew how to protect me from getting it at all, and I got it anyway. I’ll be damned if I ever believe such assurances about oral transmission. Not a punishment, just the natural consequence of his stupid choices and risks that his choices brought into my life and our marriage.

        Liked by 3 people

      2. Another signature move, is the touching themselves anywhere, anytime.
        The handbook for “gold diggers and marriage wreckers” must have listed all the MO’s, when to use it and who to pick as their next willing “victim”.

        Like

    2. Hi Lemondrop1,

      It is a special breed and they know how to get a man hard and on the way of no-return. The MO of the person who got my husband was fingering herself anywhere, anytime.
      I am sure there is a website for these creatures that explains them what to do and who to pick to be successful.
      No excuses for my husband, he was there, he knew what this was and he did not stop it, he went right for it…down in the shit and no return.

      Like

      1. I agree. No excuses. All decisions and choices they made. They both shit where they ate, risked their pay checks, bought condoms, didn’t shut down inappropriate banter, got cash out of the ATM, booked rooms at hotels, texted room numbers, etc etc. They both were married with kids, they both took time away from their families to fuck each other. There’s absolutely nothing attractive about any of it. And so many choices made to ensure they could have sex. Come to find that she’s been fucking her way to the middle for 25 years. Married more than once, cheated in every marriage, and not a looker by any standards. Or smart, or kind or respectful. Crass and unpolished and easy.

        Amazing that they each wanted to see a reflection of their greatness in the other person. Not see the affair partner, but I know my wh wanted to see himself as something more when he was with her. I told him I was jealous that she got to fuck a rich guy while I was stuck with him, debts and all. Such a fantasy life.

        I don’t think it’s a coincidence that he ended it when I left for the summer with the kids (I was unaware but so confused). Nothing to get away with, no triangle, no schedule challenge with me gone. Take me out if the picture and he gad to deal with the reality of Her and Them and it was really icky. He used her as much as she used him, and she lost her job as breadwinner. It’s all so stupid, isn’t it? And for being faithful, my sex life is horribly altered. Yay me.

        Liked by 1 person

        1. I recognise all of it Lemondrop.
          It sucks. The person my husband had an affair with (too nice a word for what it was), is very similar to the person you describe.
          It changes so much, the music I no longer listen to, the movies I can no longer stomach, the lack of trust I now have in others, emotional and physical intimacy, and so much more (such as increased anxiety and being less healthy). It still affects me, years after it ended. I have flashes of intense anger and need to use up a lot of energy to talk myself sane again. Mostly, I am all-over deeply sad that the person I gave myself to did this to our marriage. The only person I was ever 100% vulnerable with.

          Thanks for your reply. In the case of these ugly encounters, there are only losers and it is very hard to restore and start anew with hopes and a positive attitude. But that, we need to do, otherwise our lives are affected forever and we deserve better!
          Love,
          E.

          Liked by 2 people

          1. E, I recognise myself in everything you say. Since DDay I have been diagnosed with several stress-related ailments. I have developed high blood pressure, for which I now have to take medication for the rest of my life I have developed acid reflux. Ditto. I am being investigated for possuble irregular heart rhythms. I am convinced that had I not had DDay and all the subsequent three years of PTSD, none of these would have happened to me. He has literally “broken my heart”. I still have nights when I just don’t sleep. Days where I can’t concentrate enough to eat healthily and exercise properly. All down to OH’s affair. All of this will shorten my life, I am convinced. Through his selfish actions, he has literally stolen my life from me. Things may be much better now, but I still live in a constant state of anxiety and concern for the future and sadness for what I have lost. That is not healthy!

            Liked by 2 people

            1. Hi Falling Ash,
              I have all of those symptoms caused by trauma and stress as well.
              I recognise all you describe. I too believe it will affect me for the rest of my life. Irregular heartbeat as well.
              What we can do is to support each other and to acknowledge that “yes it is this bad!”
              Even if we had left our marriage, we still would have had all the symptoms, and maybe worse. Now we have taken the option to create something better. It can be done. There will be a shadow over this better relationship, and maybe that is not a bad thing as it will remind us and our spouses that we cannot take anything for granted. We have to keep on working on becoming healthy (again) and our spouses have to do the same. Creating options to express true intimacy emotionally as well as physically will be healing.
              We are not alone. We have WP and all those wonderful people who openly and honestly share what they are going through. I am very grateful to them. I am grateful to have met you!
              Love
              Elisabeth

              Liked by 2 people

                1. …and the occasional male (MC, TL’s partner) who is brave enough to open up.
                  I asked my husband to write as well, and he says he wants to, but things are holding him back ;). I called him on that. We need brave men!

                  “we will survive”, as we are strong women and mothers…
                  E.

                  Liked by 2 people

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